Why Video Commerce Is the Next Growth Lever for Shopify Brands — Unnikrshnan Kurup | Why Traffic Alone Won’t Grow Your Sales, What Makes Video Commerce Different, How Video Can Accelerate Purchases, Why Video Views Don’t Equal Sales (#502)

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00:00:00:16 - 00:00:20:20
Claus Lauter
This episode is sponsored by Bizrate Insights. Star ratings tell you how customers feel. Bizrate Insights reveals what’s driving those ratings, helping ecommerce brands create smoother shopping journeys, inspire confident purchases, and build lasting loyalty. Turn verified shopper feedback into clear priorities and better customer experiences. Learn more at bizrateinsights.com/coffee.

00:00:20:22 - 00:00:45:14
Claus Lauter
Quick one before we dive in. This episode is brought to you by Xero. Running an e-commerce or DTC brand? You know the accounting grind, multiple sales channels, invoices, reconciling every transaction by hand. Xero brings it all in one clean dashboard. Track cash flow, send invoices, and see where your business stands anytime, anywhere. As of the time of recording: Get a special Xero offer - 90% off for six months using this link. Check it out at referrals.xero.com/ecb. Ts & Cs apply.

00:00:54:16 - 00:01:18:04
Claus Lauter
Hello and welcome to another episode of the E-commerce Coffee Break podcast. ECommerce growth looks simple from the outside. Get more traffic, spend more on ads. Drive more sales. But growth can come with a hidden price at costs are rising, customer journeys are getting harder to track, and shoppers expect more than a static product page. So today we're looking at the hidden cost of e-commerce growth and why video commerce could be the next growth lever for Shopify brands.

00:01:18:05 - 00:01:31:00
Claus Lauter
To break this down, I'm joined by Unnikrshnan Kurup. He is the director of Client Consulting and Strategy as Theorem, where he helps brands rethink customer experience and how shoppers move from Discovery to Butcher's Uni. Great to have you on the show.

00:01:31:01 - 00:01:50:08
Unnikrshnan Kurup
Thanks class. I'm really excited. It's a topic that's very close to me. And, you know, we've been sort of working on this for the last. I mean, I've been on with the e-commerce industry for the last about 20, 23 years. So, you know, I'm really looking forward to this conversation and excited to see what we can sort of help the Shopify merchants with.

00:01:50:10 - 00:01:55:08
Claus Lauter
Yeah, let's jump right into it. So what are the hidden costs of growing an e-commerce brand?

00:01:55:14 - 00:02:21:04
Unnikrshnan Kurup
You know, ecommerce doesn't have an attention problem, right? I mean, I say it doesn't have an attention problem. What I mean by that is that all the effort up until I think a few years ago or even now, to a lot of extent is really going into sort of creating this attention, right? And now, because of how fragmented the media landscape is, you know, with all the privacy issues and, you know, the way the paid media economics have changed, you know, it's becoming really, really expensive.

00:02:21:04 - 00:02:41:01
Unnikrshnan Kurup
And what's happening is I think brands are looking at, you know, they want to grow traffic, right. And that's kind of been the main area. But I think traffic is now very old school, you know, and because it's all school, I say that because if you want to get more traffic, you're going to eventually start spending a lot more money because you're trying to go into a very cluttered environment.

00:02:41:02 - 00:03:02:03
Unnikrshnan Kurup
Right. But if you look at it from an e-commerce brand perspective, having traffic means nothing. You know, traffic doesn't equate to growth, you know, and that's kind of why these sort of media companies are really sort of increasing these costs. And I think e-commerce companies are kind of falling into the brand bandwagon of saying, oh, I just need to get that right.

00:03:02:04 - 00:03:19:04
Unnikrshnan Kurup
But I think what they're not understanding is they probably need to optimize more for the traffic that they have currently than actually try and build more and more traffic. And I think that is really the discord or the disproportion. And that's why the costs are increasing. You know, so that's kind of the way I would look at it.

00:03:19:05 - 00:03:31:18
Claus Lauter
Yeah, I would agree. I mean, you mentioned it quite rightly is like people really think more traffic will make more money at the bank end, but that's just not the case. So where are brands losing money in the customer journey?

00:03:31:20 - 00:03:54:12
Unnikrshnan Kurup
Yeah. So this is another big thing right? So I think as I said earlier right. It's no more about I don't think e-commerce brands have an attention problem. I think where the where the big problem lies is really in a confidence. There's a huge confidence gap among the consumers. Right. And that's really where I feel that the e-commerce brands need to spend their time, money and energy.

00:03:54:12 - 00:04:27:06
Unnikrshnan Kurup
So let me give you an example. Right. So for example social social is such a big deal right. Consumers are there. Consumers are there. Consumers are there. But what you're essentially doing is you're creating all this beautiful content, all this experience content. Again, with the focus of getting just attention, you're literally going into a clutter, right? But at the same time, you're not really solving the customer problem because the customer is on TikTok, a customer is on Instagram, a customer is on your website, he's on search, he's here, he's there, you know, and he's like, he's getting different experiences.

00:04:27:06 - 00:04:52:15
Unnikrshnan Kurup
So brand is finding it or not finding it. They're not really maintaining their experience across all the paid channels that they're on. Right. And because of which they're having a huge problem in this whole conversion. And that's what I meant, right. It is that confidence gap because I don't think they're getting a consistent information or a consistency in terms of what this product can do for me, that I can make that decision to buy it.

00:04:52:15 - 00:05:11:01
Unnikrshnan Kurup
And I think that is why it is really important for ecommerce brands to really focus on that confidence gap. I call it the decision to confidence gap, and I think that's where it is. Or a discovery to confidence gap, right. And that's really what the real problem is in my opinion.

00:05:11:03 - 00:05:33:17
Claus Lauter
Now obviously communicating to your potential customers out there in different ways, I think one way that is probably the best one is video, and we want to dive a little bit more in this on how you can facilitate video in your marketing strategy to really get more business in through the door. Tell me your perspective. Why is videos one of the main goals to work on?

00:05:33:18 - 00:05:52:18
Unnikrshnan Kurup
So let me before I get into video, I think I want to sort of clarify there's a very nuanced difference between when I say video and when I say video commerce. Right? Because I think when you talk about video most of the time, and I think this is what's happening, you know, currently is that people are looking at video as an asset, right?

00:05:52:19 - 00:06:17:01
Unnikrshnan Kurup
Yes, it is an asset, but I think it's very nuanced. Right. But what we are talking about and what I'm trying to say is that you need to look at video as an infrastructure layer, which is more than just an asset. You need to you need to look at video in terms of what is the problem, what is that confidence problem, or what is the uncertainty of a customer that it is trying to solve.

00:06:17:02 - 00:06:38:07
Unnikrshnan Kurup
Right. Again, don't mix it with attention. Mix it with the confidence gap. Keep the confidence gap in mind. And then when you look at video it becomes a whole different ball game right now. Again some of the questions that you might ask me or what people listening might be thinking, but hey, TikTok really works, right? Because I've got the video, I've got the shopping.

00:06:38:07 - 00:07:02:06
Unnikrshnan Kurup
Yes, definitely. But TikTok is one medium. It's not the only medium where your customers come, right. You have one set of customers who are coming there through one particular medium, but you've got the whole other part that is missing, right? So imagine I'm on Instagram and you have given me this amazing, beautiful video of this beauty product. Let's say if it's a serum, I'm just going to use serum as a constant example.

00:07:02:08 - 00:07:26:22
Unnikrshnan Kurup
Right. And you've told me how you know what it does, how it is. And I'm like, wow, this is great. Let me click on it and I want to buy it because you cannot fulfill a transaction and Instagram or wherever. So you come to the website and you're like, wow, I had an amazing experience there. And when I come here, I'm saying something that is 30 years dated of here's a product description, here are some text and I don't have anything right.

00:07:26:23 - 00:07:45:22
Unnikrshnan Kurup
So I'm going like, wait a minute. Is this the same brand I looked into? That's it. I've lost. You know, the brand has lost me. I'm going to be totally out of there. So when I talk about video, I'm saying that now you need a video, but that video should be answering a particular gap. Right. And you have to identify what that gap is.

00:07:45:22 - 00:08:07:11
Unnikrshnan Kurup
You're trying to basically help the customer take away his uncertainty in terms that, you know, this is what I need, and that is what I'm trying to say. Again, when I talk about video commerce, I'm not saying that every video commerce or every video that when I classify it as video commerce needs to have a transactional element to it.

00:08:07:12 - 00:08:35:17
Unnikrshnan Kurup
What I mean by that is it should not. It's not that unless it has a shop now, it is a shop. It is only then is it a video commerce. Know what I mean by that is you need to put the video there where it is at the correct moment, where the where the customer wants to make that decision to buy and somehow maybe continue their experience so that he's closer to finishing it or, you know, it has a commercial aspect associated with it.

00:08:35:17 - 00:08:47:23
Unnikrshnan Kurup
So that's kind of where I look at it, right? It needs to be a way of increasing the path to purchase or accelerating the path to purchase. So I think that's what it is.

00:08:48:00 - 00:09:12:22
Claus Lauter
This episode is sponsored by Bizrate Insights. Your analytics can show you what shoppers do, but verified feedback reveals why BizRate Insights helps e-commerce brands understand the full customer journey from discovery and checkout through post-purchase and fulfillment so teams can create smoother experiences, drive more purchases, and strengthen customer loyalty. Move beyond just star ratings, and uncover the insights that show you where to focus next. Turn shopper feedback into clear, practical action at BizRate Insights.com/coffee

00:09:19:01 - 00:09:51:02
Claus Lauter
Let's talk about the headache every online seller knows: multiple sales channels, inventory that never quite matches, invoices piling up, hours lost, reconciling instead of running your business. That's where today's sponsor Xero comes in. Xero is cloud accounting software built for growing e-commerce and DTC brands. Track cash flow in real time. Send and chase invoices automatically, reconcile bank transactions in a couple of clicks and see exactly where your business stands from a laptop or phone. It connects with the tools online sellers already rely on. At the time of recording, get a special Xero offer: 90% off for six months using this link head to referrals.xero.com/ecb
To see how Xero can simplify your books. Ts & Cs apply. I like this approach because it's always and it was always presenting the right information in the right moment to get people through the customer journey. Now, video is a great tool, but as I said, video is sometimes only part of the journey. Can you give me an example what a great video shopping experience would look like from A to Z?

00:10:22:23 - 00:10:41:00
Unnikrshnan Kurup
Yeah, I can tell you. So let's say for example, I'm a beauty company. As I said, you know, I'll keep the serum as an example, let's say I'm a beauty product selling serum, right? I have a serum that costs $90 right now. If I really want to ensure that the customer converts this, my video should basically talk about.

00:10:41:00 - 00:10:58:11
Unnikrshnan Kurup
Or the brands should figure out what are the main customer pain points that I can fulfill with this video. So what is it? If I'm buying a serum, I want to know how does it benefit me? Obviously the ingredients, the ingredients will be there in the product page, but how does it affect me? How much should I use it?

00:10:58:12 - 00:11:23:05
Unnikrshnan Kurup
Is it okay for my skin type? You know, will it actually make the difference that it talks about? And what is the reason to believe. Right. So this is an actual content that needs to go. If I can give that much information. I think that is what is going to help in terms of what that is. And I think the most important part is to decide where in the commerce journey or where in the customer journey.

00:11:23:05 - 00:11:42:04
Unnikrshnan Kurup
I need to put this. Putting this on the home page makes absolutely no sense, right? You need to put it at a point where you're giving the mirror of information. They have seen enough information and they're at the point of that's it, I want to buy it now. And that is the complexity of the nuance of how you should look at video commerce.

00:11:42:04 - 00:11:57:15
Unnikrshnan Kurup
And again, when you look at it from that perspective, video stops becoming an asset and it starts becoming something more than just an asset. It becomes your conversion channel. And in a sense, that is video commerce for you.

00:11:57:17 - 00:12:17:13
Claus Lauter
Obviously, people can consume and digest and process video much, much easier than reading. Most people are just scanning a text or skipping text, and then the customer support has to deal with all the questions that are already answered on the product page, but no one reads. So video has definitely a huge benefit over just a normal product page.

00:12:17:15 - 00:12:22:07
Claus Lauter
How should brands measure how it drives sales or how much sales it drives?

00:12:22:08 - 00:12:41:12
Unnikrshnan Kurup
Just to address your first point, you're absolutely right. The consumer behavior, the customer behavior is obviously changed. And that's why we've seen a rise in video. Right. And that's kind of the whole idea of of why discovery is primarily now video based. Right. Everybody goes to a YouTube or an Instagram or a TikTok or whatever other video medium to do that.

00:12:41:12 - 00:13:01:20
Unnikrshnan Kurup
And that's why I probably also search a lot is reducing in search and all these, you know, sort of model searches are coming with, you know, showing videos. Sorry, I just I didn't cover that, but that was just a given. But to your point, in terms of measuring, that's another very good question. So I think what's important is we should stop measuring shiny metrics.

00:13:01:20 - 00:13:30:10
Unnikrshnan Kurup
When I say shiny metrics is how many people viewed the video. Viewing a video has got absolutely nothing. Zero. Not a in terms of how it will convert into a sale. Right. And this is kind of where sort of the marketing people in brands and agencies get it wrong. And it's not really a brand problem, because I think the way the business is happening is a typical e-commerce brand would work with a performance based company, a social company, a brand company, right.

00:13:30:11 - 00:13:52:21
Unnikrshnan Kurup
Each of these people are coming with their metrics, right? And they're saying, oh, look, I'm a social agency. Look how many likes it. Got it. Look how many views it got. Look how many. And they're like, wow, this is great. But then and the marketer will say, wow, this is amazing. But when he gets that data and he's talking to his board, he'll be like the, you know, the CEO or somebody is asking him or the CMO is asking him, great, what does this mean?

00:13:52:21 - 00:14:11:00
Unnikrshnan Kurup
My sales still seem to be where they are. Nothing has increased. So why am I giving you so much money when you're not really increasing my sales? And this is a constant battle between sales and marketing, right? So when you look at video commerce and when you want to measure it, I think when you figure out what is the pain that you're trying to do.

00:14:11:00 - 00:14:37:22
Unnikrshnan Kurup
So there's obviously the conversion metric which is a given. Right. Is this converted. So that is there. But I think it's also to do with have you taken that customer pain and try to convert it. So even if somebody in an e-commerce has added it to the cart, it's a big deal, right? Because then you can have different strategies to convert it, because that is also telling you that you need to maybe change your messaging a little bit because they haven't really fulfilled it at that particular point in time.

00:14:37:22 - 00:14:56:12
Unnikrshnan Kurup
So the metrics, you know, I said, I would say shiny metrics are important. When I say shiny metrics, views are important. But when you look at it from a video commerce or, or a ecommerce metric, I think it should be more than just that. It has to be conversions, of course, but it also has to be how many people have added to the cart.

00:14:56:15 - 00:15:18:15
Unnikrshnan Kurup
You know, how many people have maybe just jumped off my page, you know, with even after watching the video. And I think the beauty of video commerce is it can give you that kind of data, it can give you behavioral data, it can give you even a lot in terms of demographic data, which is really important for you to sort of have more strategies around that.

00:15:18:17 - 00:15:28:02
Claus Lauter
Now at theorem, you are helping brands with implementing this. What's your approach if a brand comes to you? Where do you start? What's your your help?

00:15:28:08 - 00:15:48:13
Unnikrshnan Kurup
What we do is, you know, we help brands sort of identify the friction between what content do they have, what are the content and experience gaps, and how can we do solve it. And what we do is we tell them that don't invest in technology and don't invest in paying us till we actually figure out what is the pain that we are trying to solve.

00:15:48:13 - 00:16:15:18
Unnikrshnan Kurup
And the way we do that is we first tell them, let's identify which is the product page or which is the PDP page that is getting the maximum traffic or which is your hero product. Let's take that. Let's go into your PDP page and figure out. Do you have enough information there or do you have a video there, or do you have enough content there that is going to take away the uncertainty of a particular customer, right.

00:16:15:19 - 00:16:35:04
Unnikrshnan Kurup
So if it is like let's say if it is serum's like, do you have enough information about that product which basically takes away that uncertainty? Then we tell them what they need to do, how they need to create it. We created for them, we implement it. And then before we implement it, we say, this is what we're going to test it against.

00:16:35:04 - 00:16:53:00
Unnikrshnan Kurup
And then once we implement it, we get that data and only then do we then push it live and say, okay, now we can actually go and, you know, do this across your entire commerce or a customer journey. So that's really how we sort of differentiate ourselves. We are not saying out of the gate, believe in it, let's just go.

00:16:53:01 - 00:17:02:16
Unnikrshnan Kurup
We want to show you proof. And it's a fully sort of system that has minimal sort of human intervention, and then we move it from there.

00:17:02:18 - 00:17:17:14
Claus Lauter
So it's pretty much data based. And to really find out which data points move the needle there. Now can you share some kind. And you don't need to name the brands. But do you have any success stories or case studies that you can share with our listeners what kind of results your clients saw?

00:17:17:18 - 00:17:44:22
Unnikrshnan Kurup
So I can't name the client. We actually just won the best MarTech award in the US, basically for a for a brand that we ran a one month pilot with Video Commerce, and they saw an increase of about 10 to 12% in their conversions, you know, and it was a brand that was already doing well in conversions. But I think just adding that video commerce element had a huge impact on their conversions, had a huge impact on repeat purchases.

00:17:44:23 - 00:18:10:06
Unnikrshnan Kurup
And I can share the link later. Maybe you can put it in the recording where people can actually go and see the actual record. And I think that's a very interesting case study, because the way we went with it is the brand came to us and said, hey, we don't really have a conversion problem, but I think what we have is we want to better our experience, you know, because they are spending a lot of time and energy and money in trying to explain the product.

00:18:10:06 - 00:18:27:21
Unnikrshnan Kurup
So they've got that whole thing laid out very nicely. Right? So the minute you have a problem, you can basically use the chat. Somebody will answer, you can pick up the phone, you can do that. But can you imagine the cost of actually maintaining that call center, of actually creating that chat? All that was sort of adding up in their cause.

00:18:28:00 - 00:18:48:14
Unnikrshnan Kurup
So they said, is there a more efficient way of doing this wherein we see, obviously, you know, our increase in conversions, but we also see a decrease in our sort of overall CapEx and opex costs. Right. And that's kind of how it came into fruition. And that's the strategy we went with. And I think they had great success in terms of what that is.

00:18:48:15 - 00:18:54:20
Unnikrshnan Kurup
And I think that's why we are now hopefully going to have like a full fledged strategy with them.

00:18:54:20 - 00:19:17:00
Claus Lauter
It's a great example because it shows you that the hidden costs are not always obvious, because you try to provide a great service to your customer. So you have a call center and everything just to provide them any time with the right information. But it blows up your budget for all these things you need. And video can do this much faster, last quicker, much cheaper.

00:19:17:00 - 00:19:23:10
Claus Lauter
So I think that's that's a great solution there. Tell me, who's your perfect customer? What kind of brands or verticals do you work with.

00:19:23:10 - 00:19:49:19
Unnikrshnan Kurup
So our focus has really been across sort of, you know, for major verticals. We work with beauty, we work with fashion. We don't really work with luxury fashion because luxury fashion is quite nuanced. When I say nuanced, as they have their own set of very specific problems. So we so we don't we have not really gone there. So we do with fashion like, you know, fast street fashion, fashion, apparel, FMcG, health and wellness.

00:19:49:21 - 00:19:53:05
Unnikrshnan Kurup
And these are the kind of categories that we deal with.

00:19:53:07 - 00:19:59:00
Claus Lauter
Walk me through a typical onboarding process of a new client. How long does it take? What steps are involved?

00:19:59:03 - 00:20:19:15
Unnikrshnan Kurup
As I told you, the way we have designed is we don't. We always tell the client that, you know, I think one of the things that I want to say before we go is, you know, video commerce, when we talk about video commerce, there's a lot of misconceptions, right? Because nobody really understands video commerce. The term video commerce is very confusing because people think video commerce is social commerce.

00:20:19:15 - 00:20:42:04
Unnikrshnan Kurup
People think video commerce is live commerce. So there's a there's a whole survey and education process that goes into explaining what do we mean by video commerce. So that's one second is what we've noticed is there's a huge perception point in terms of why video commerce hasn't really picked up the way it needs to be. Right? Because I think people still think, and this is a very wrong perception.

00:20:42:07 - 00:21:02:00
Unnikrshnan Kurup
They think one, it is very expensive because, you know, I need to create all this tech. I need to have all this tech in terms of how do I do this? Because as I said, they think video commerce is live commerce. Second is they think it's really expensive to execute it, and they probably need a whole different department apart from what they have to actually run this.

00:21:02:00 - 00:21:21:23
Unnikrshnan Kurup
Right. So when we onboard typically we have we pretty much take about, you know, 2 to 3 sessions to explain and sort of, you know, kill these misconceptions right out of the gate so they get the value. They love the value. Again, you know, the minute you talk video commerce and you show them what it can do to you, all brands love it.

00:21:21:23 - 00:21:38:16
Unnikrshnan Kurup
They're like, wow, we want it. But they're like, you know, we've we've heard it's expensive. We don't really have a team that does it, you know, and we don't want to really invest that much of money. And then you say all fair points, but let me tell you, it's actually not expensive. It is pretty much exactly what you're doing right now.

00:21:38:19 - 00:21:54:02
Unnikrshnan Kurup
It is an added layer that is sort of going to confirm in a way that, you know, you're going to get the needed ROI that you need to get. So that takes about two days. And then after that, you know, we kind of work with the brand in terms of what is their objective, what do they want to achieve?

00:21:54:03 - 00:22:12:23
Unnikrshnan Kurup
Because I think it's really important for us to work with them in terms of what is their KPI. As I said, the business KPI is always conversion, but I think there are layers to what that means. So I would say anyway, the engagement can take from a week to ten days in terms of onboarding, and then we sort of kick it off from there.

00:22:12:23 - 00:22:36:00
Unnikrshnan Kurup
The biggest chunk of that process is understanding what is that pain point that we are trying to, you know, negate for that customer and for that product in order for us to be able to create that video. And hey, the other big thing that comes up is I have to create this video, which means I have to do a shoot, I have to do this.

00:22:36:00 - 00:22:56:02
Unnikrshnan Kurup
I have to be like, no, no, no. You have these existing content nowadays technology exists, which is AI, which is going to help you scale. But there is an aspect to it wherein you also need to think, and we need to work with you in terms of what that messaging needs to be. Right. So I think when we say that they get it.

00:22:56:02 - 00:23:13:10
Unnikrshnan Kurup
So what essentially we try to do is we try to break down and explain to them that our solution gives you the ROI. It helps you scale easily and without any cost, because that's the need or the R, and it's very easy to implement.

00:23:13:12 - 00:23:38:23
Claus Lauter
I think one point that's also very important is like to have someone from the outside looking at your business and really finding and sort of reformulate the pain point, because sometimes as a business owner, as a brand owner, you don't see the forest because of the trees. So and then if somebody comes external and looks at you and say, here we go, this is your pain point and let's work on this is a huge value that you bring to the table.

00:23:39:00 - 00:23:44:12
Claus Lauter
Now before our coffee break comes to an end today, is there anything you want to share with our listeners that we haven't covered yet?

00:23:44:13 - 00:23:59:22
Unnikrshnan Kurup
Well, I think I would just like to say to all the Shopify merchants who will be listening in and who is saying that I think what I want to say is that it's not about thinking that, oh, I need more video. That is not what I'm saying. Right? And it's not that the more video you add, it's better.

00:23:59:22 - 00:24:28:11
Unnikrshnan Kurup
It's about really looking at what is your objective and how can you take away that pain point or that uncertainty of a particular customer or of your customers, and create videos around that with an element to ensure that you take away that decision gap, or you narrow that decision gap in order to create that conversion. And I think that's the one thing I would I would want to sort of, you know, leave everyone with.

00:24:28:12 - 00:24:33:23
Unnikrshnan Kurup
So I don't want people to think I'm talking about add more videos. They'll be like, that's what we do now. That's what it is.

00:24:34:00 - 00:24:40:01
Claus Lauter
Know very, very, very clear. And it makes total sense. Now where can people go and find out more about you guys?

00:24:40:03 - 00:24:58:03
Unnikrshnan Kurup
We have a website, Theorem Digital, so they can go log in to our website and they can get all the information from us. Or there's my LinkedIn page. You can always contact me. And we are more than happy to sort of have that conversation and tell you what the value of a solution is, and how it can help their business.

00:24:58:07 - 00:25:11:08
Claus Lauter
Perfect. I will put the links in the show notes as always, and you just one click away only. Thanks so much for your time. I think that was a really great overview why video has become so important, and I hope a lot of people will reach out to you. Thanks so much for your time.

00:25:11:08 - 00:25:15:09
Unnikrshnan Kurup
Thanks. Thank you so much. Thank you very much.

00:25:15:11 - 00:25:35:06
Claus Lauter
This episode was sponsored by BizRate Insights. Every customer journey has opportunities to improve. BizRate Insights, turns verify chopper feedback into clear priorities, helping e-commerce brands make smarter decisions, strengthen customer relationships, and help customers coming back. Learn more at BizRateInsights.com/coffee.

00:25:35:08 - 00:26:00:21
Claus Lauter
That's all for this episode. Thanks again to Xero for sponsoring today's show. If you're tired of messy spreadsheets and manual, reconciling, Xero brings your invoicing, cash flow, and reporting into one simple dashboard. At the time of recording get a special Xero offer 90% off for six months using this link. Check it out at referrals.xero.com/ecb. That's referrals.xero.com/ecb. Thanks for listening. We will catch you next time. Ts & Cs apply.